/mbti/

Look up your mom's vagina

t. ESTP monkey

>it should be a clusterfuck
The problem presented in the graph seems simple enough, I think the Ti image fits because it displays its lack of rigor compared to Te and the process-oriented aspect of it instead of Te's precise goal-oriented, efficient methodology

>Your definition of an advanced INTx might be a little off because the more i progress throughout life, the more unsure of everything i become, nothing is certain.

That's nearly the first step on the way. They just call it the "doubting" phase. In that place, people are beginning to see things simply as they are, rather than their previously faulty interpretation of it that they used to have so much confidence in. For an INTP especially, this will cause them to be worried about their own judgement calls and then it's just a snowball effect of doubt. It's normal. Every INTP was once a child INTP swimming in a sea of childish ideas, surrounded by people with bad judgement. As you gain experience, you'll recalibrate your outlook naturally. You'll move past it.

>Confidence is the biggest sign of immaturity

In an INTP, to an INTP, it feels that way. Other archetypes would say that the biggest sign of immatury is something else. INTJ's would say "being controlled by emotions". ENTJ's would say "underconfidence". In objective truth, overconfidence is the biggest sign of carelessness.

Fi doesn't like to see things that go against its personal values, right? So for example they'll be personally affected by what they perceive as injustice even though there's nothing they can do about it?
What does Fe dislike?

Kek that Ni diagram gets me every time. We out hur

People acting for their own intrests first, at the expence of the group

A need me a waifu. I won't ever find me a gf anyway

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>yeah actually i don't and i would probably fight her for control because that's just fucked to get used like that by some hole.

It's not as base and vulgar as you're thinking. It's entirely out of love and she makes it worth your while.

Interestingly, your resistence only makes her passion to break it stronger. And if she's smart, she'll get what she wants. Eventually, she'll have given you enough evidence that her judgement can be trusted. Trustworthy, solid evidence. The crack-cocaine of the INTP.
At some point you will have to take a "trust-fall" for her. And once you do, you'll be enamoured with her forever.

Coming out of the other side of some debacle mostly unscathed because you immediately trusted her when she said "jump out of this plane with no parachute" and it turned out well.. Something about that really seals the deal with the INTP. Maybe it's the earned respect? The reliability? I'm not sure.

>Absolutely
W-where do I get one
Although I'm wary because for what it's worth a lot of fictional ESFJs I'm familiar with I find really insufferable. personality-database.com/mbti-type/4/ESFJ
>if you let them speak
So it's a type that theoretically combines being caring, understanding and generally easy to get along with with a good level of intellectual sharpness and curiosity? What about high Fe, doesn't that make them a bit too concerned with group dynamics?
>They're insecure about showing that side
How do they grow out of that state?
I'm insecure about showing any kind of emotional vulnerability so I'm guessing it's a mutually beneficial kind of relationship?

>In that place, people are beginning to see things simply as they are
I really doubt that, people first begin with confidence, then immediately fall into doubt, then pick themselves up into confidence again as their skills grow, you probably know about the dunning kruger effect. However, that confidence does not mean they view themselves to have the ultimate answer, it just means they trust their own answer more than other peoples answers. I always see "experts" on a topic answer with uncertainty, they have a "you never know" attitude to things.

>Every INTP was once a child INTP swimming in a sea of childish ideas, surrounded by people with bad judgement. As you gain experience, you'll recalibrate your outlook naturally. You'll move past it.
Of course you will recalibrate your outlook but you will never move past it as an INTP, that recaliberation is a constant part of our lives, we are always looking for new perspective, never accepting that we are right.

In an INTP, to an INTP, it feels that way. Other archetypes would say that the biggest sign of immatury is something else. INTJ's would say "being controlled by emotions". ENTJ's would say "underconfidence". In objective truth, overconfidence is the biggest sign of carelessness.
I know this, i was merely answering a subjective question with my subjective viewpoint, immaturity can look like many different things to many different people, this is no right answer but there are less accurate ones. I believe that coping is immature, when the other user implied it was a mature act, i told him why i thought it wasn't mature then added my own perspective for him to possibly debunk

>At some point you will have to take a "trust-fall" for her. And once you do, you'll be enamoured with her forever.
Not the same guy but I do see loyalty and trustworthiness as a recurring theme in INTPs' perception of what is most important in a partner. Generally I think reliability is attractive to INTPs, but why is that? Tertiary Si?

Even simple problems don't have simple answers, a Ti user would question why he has to go to the other side of the wall in the first place

It probably has nothing to do with functions, no one likes us so we just want someone that will stick with us

that sounds like it's too much work for what it's worth.

i just want to fuck and have a relationship, not some gay love story about trust with chains and whips like some 50 shades of gray shit. i don't want to endure some dumb punishment or something, i'll just find a sub girl because that seems more preferable anyway compared to dealing with some alpha macho girl thinking she's hot shit and running the relationship.

i'd rather build my own shitty ship and be my own captain and go nowhere forever than trust the direction of some xNTJ ever again. had a friendship like that and it was fucking stupid to deal with and incredibly annoying. i fucking hate Ni and Te together in any order at the top. it's stupid and i don't know why people think it's compatible.

You think? I know not everything can be explained by cognitive functions but it's interesting to try to figure it out anyway.
The qualities I'd say are most important in a partner, in no particular order, are honesty, reliability and kindness; the rest is peripheral. Kindness is something everyone expects of their partner but to me, honesty is definitely a consequence of me valuing Ti and needing to be able to talk about things clearly and openly when necessary. I read that tertiary Si in INTPs translated as a desire for safety and security, so it's likely the reliability thing can be chalked up to that.

What makes Ni-Te so annoying? I don't know what xNTJs are like in real life.

>I read that tertiary Si in INTPs translated as a desire for safety and security, so it's likely the reliability thing can be chalked up to that.
It might be, im just guessing like you. The reason why i think it has nothing to do with functions and more to do with our value as people is because chads just plow and dumb, they have plenty of options so they don't care whether they are betrayed. If INTPs are betrayed, we have no one and we get hurt. Now that i think about it, we don't really trust anyone because we are scared of being hurt so we just want someone we can open up to like you said.

This is kinda complicated, the question that needs to be answered first is that if there we a romantically successful INTP (a mythical creature indeed), would he value trustworthiness and loyalty as much as we do?

incredibly closed off and forceful with ideas.

the re-occurring pattern that would happen every time is NTJ wanted to do something and bring me along, i reluctantly agreed to do the thing, it got boring and i stopped caring because i wanted to do other things, would tell NTJ how they are wrong and aren't considering x, y, z things but they never seemed to care, NTJ would get annoyed. i would fuck off for a while and do my own thing and NTJ would pick a fight because they still want my assistance and picking a fight is a great way to pick my brain and give them criticism and ideas.

it seemed like a very tool-oriented mindset that they have where i was one to bounce ideas off of and check and NTJ would just use me in that way and get frustrated if i didn't do it.

they have a particular direction they are going and they want to drag me along to fulfill their vision. sometimes that vision is fucking stupid and dumb and just idealized and NTJ would get incredibly forceful because their conception of things is all they care about and they want to constantly move towards it as fast as they can. it is incredibly narrow in scope, very suface level with it's information, and just fucking annoying to me.

plow and dump*
were a romantically successful INTP*

You have posted this spiel so many times dude, let it go

I know lol, they cant handle our fire!

Why is ENTP just the best?

>How is that addressing it head on? Its like replacing smoking with overeating, there is a bigger underlying problem you are completely ignoring. You are only healthy when you don't have to cope, if you have to cope, something is clearly wrong somewhere to necessitate that and not addressing is immature.

Because it's like reacting to a fire right away instead of letting it burn the whole house to the ground either because 1) you ignored it when it was growing or 2) you are unaware that it is growing until you're consumed in it.

In order to get to a place where you never have to cope, you'd have to go to a monestary in solitude and meditate nearly 16 hours per day. Monks are the only group of people who have been able to re-write their brains to that extraordinary extent. Now for the rest of us, we learn how to dodge or fight our shortcomings in the most harmonious way possible. Our weaknesses are still there, but they aren't controlling our lives to a detrimental extent. It's not something you can learn by force. The requirements to learn are time, effort, and no force.

Why are ENTPs the only type that manage to really push my buttons even though we use the exact same functions? It's weird.
I can deal with feelers flipping out because I just dismiss it as over-emotional irrationality, but ENTPs are just something else. Is Ne really that cancerous when there's nothing to keep it in check?
>inb4 the inevitable triumphant (you)s from ENTPs who see it as a victory to be disliked

Not every Ti user is an INTP you know

>The true answer to this problem is questioning "why" you hate that, then addressing/accepting the bigger problem as a whole, not trying to force everyone into doing what you want nor begrudgingly accepting it as a cope

Your "true answer" is what immature people try to do. They try to exert concious control until they are frustrated, exhausted and make no progress. No person with a bad habit is able to stop that habit by simply asking "Why am I like this" and then "addressing(not accepting) the bigger problem as a whole". Which your explination of "addressing the bigger problem" you left intentionally ambigious because you don't know what it is. Because no matter how much time you spend looking, that answer doesn't exist. Immature people assume the answer must be to control. And when their stamina for controlling their mind runs dry, what happens to them? They fall into their 3 y.o. function. They feel that they have to control. They're having an outburst. The people around them know that they are immature.

>..nor begrudgingly accepting it as a cope

I didn't tell you they were accepting things begrudgingly. You added that. They do it honesty out of wisdom. Not begrudgingly out of force. But you'd force your own interpretation in there and come up with bad conclusions. Don't feel bad at all. You've still a ways to go. Best thing you can do now is just observe things *only for what they are* and stop adding or taking away your own bits that aren't really there.

I think the picture implied the use of functions as leading in the stack, which would make the Ti one appropriate for IxTPs.

I swear I have read this before.
Is this pasta?

no but i re tell it like said.

The triumph comes from liking ourselves.

I'm honestly trying to figure this out, not ranting.
You guys mainly use Ne-Ti, I mainly use Ti-Ne. Why is it that our processes are so different? I don't enjoy arguing "for the sake of it", whenever I argue there's a reason for it, like wanting to figure something out most of the time. You guys enjoy antagonizing people for some reason, how is that not contradictory given that you have tertiary Fe?
In terms of functions, ENTPs and INTPs are very similar, yet I get the impression that we're extremely different in practice, and only similar in our tendency to jump from one idea to another.
Even the reasoning ENTPs use is one that doesn't sit well with me. I tend to consider every option as possible (even if not likely) and don't readily argue with the utmost certainty that something is bullshit unless I can prove it. Most ENTPs I've talked to seem to be very quick to dismiss ideas, sometimes just because of false assumptions or (most of the time, and this one is annoying) because they spotted a small logical inconsistency that isn't very relevant to the idea as a whole but that they still feel the need to point out in order to "invalidate" it.
What's your take on what I wrote?

It was decided last thread: ENTPs are essentially niggers.

>Loud
>Argumentative
>Obnoxious
>Don't actually do things
>Undeserved sense of confidence
>Think people love their presence
>Shit on people for caring about stuff

Absolute niggers in every sense.

fucking based ENTPs

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>INTP
Why god
Why did you leave us unfinished.

based and truthpilled
ENTPs are about as cancerous as trannies and kikes
t. INTP

>that sounds like it's too much work for what it's worth.
All you have to do is do what you do best. Respond to inputs.

>i just want to fuck and have a relationship, not some gay love story about trust with chains and whips like some 50 shades of gray shit. i don't want to endure some dumb punishment or something,

And she will respect you for that. And it's large reason why she won't leave you. You're internally authentic. True to yourself. You're one of the rare types which can keep your internal compass strong in the violent sea of love and lust. Or as you said "fuck" and "relationship". The advanced ENTJ has a problem with other types. She will either leave them because they won't trust her enough despite her proving her competence.. or because they fall completely into her and become coomers dangling off her finger. She'll leave them because they're disgusting and impossible to respect and she deserves better.

>i'll just find a sub girl because that seems more preferable anyway
Easier is less rewarding.

>compared to dealing with some alpha macho girl thinking she's hot shit and running the relationship.
Thinking you're hot shit is not the same has being confident because you have a track history of success. Has no one ever earned your respect in your life? Someone who has proven themselves to be competent?

>i'd rather build my own shitty ship and be my own captain and go nowhere forever than trust the direction of some xNTJ ever again. had a friendship like that and it was fucking stupid to deal with and incredibly annoying.

Obviously, you have baggage. Probably you were with an immature version. They'll pretty much be borderline personality disorder and that's definitely a fucking nightmare. You *could* paint every person in the group with the same brush..but you shouldn't.

>Your MBTI type
>Your preferred MBTI type for a partner
>why

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>You're internally authentic. True to yourself
Aren't you confusing INTPs with INFPs?

so much wall of texts

>Monks are the only group of people who have been able to re-write their brains
Why would you believe monks are some special people who trained themselves to the point of doing the impossible? Despite how the media portrays them, they are just a bunch of people who sit around all day doing completely pointless things

>They try to exert concious control until they are frustrated
Thats why i added "accepting", if its an unsolvable problem, then accepting that its an unsolvable problem is the mature thing.

>Which your explination of "addressing the bigger problem" you left intentionally ambigious
Its ambigious because it can be applied to any situation but let me answer the bigger problem to that previous example. The reason why INTPs get frustrated when people are wrong is because the want others to know how smart they are in comparison to them "how dare that scientist/person be viewed as smart when i can clearly prove them wrong". This has yet an even bigger underlying problem, INTPs feel they aren't valued by anyone and truth be told, they aren't, they feel if people knew how "smart and accurate" they were, others would like them, doesnt happen, so in essence, accepting that no one will love you for wanting to be smart is the mature answer (or trying to fix it somehow if you can), you will no longer have a desire to prove people wrong. The reason why i didn't tell you this originally is because it gives people an easy way to shrug off my argument as projection

>I didn't tell you they were accepting things begrudgingly
"Many an INTP summed up their coping with this problem as "I respect your American right to be wrong."" Is that not begrudgingly accepting things?

Why are ESFPs so fucking based?

youtube.com/watch?v=l0Op_32zz1k

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INTJ here, I'm on my path to wizardhood.

I have an ENTP friend who have had like 16 girlfriends, a ENFJ friend who is a manwhore and fucks women from tinder pretty much every weekend and a ISTJ friend who had a girlfriend for seven years who broke up with him and married some other dude a few months later. The ISTJ and the ENFJ don't know each other.

I tried befriending the INTPs at my college but it didn't work out very well, but I got their contacts and we exchange memes online though so it was not entirely a waste of time

I know being vulnerable sucks but trying to meet girls, getting owned, and trying again is the only way you're going to acquire the skillset needed to seduce them. Might be hard on the ego but literally nobody else has to know man, just approach it systemically like everything else.

>What makes Ni-Te so annoying? I don't know what xNTJs are like in real life.

In general? They're not annoying. They stay out the way or recluse entirely. In a relationship? ..It's also that they're not annoying. They are impossible to open up. They will never ever be vulnerable with you. No matter how much love and effort you pour into them, they keep their armor on tight.. until they suffocate in it. It takes a unique kind of person to enter their heartspace. "Enter", because of all the types, their armor cannot/will not be "broken". They have to let you in. And they fucking wont.

What makes this guy an ESFP?

well first of all as this guy said yeah i don't think INTPs sense of authenticity is all that important to them. they have some principals they don't like compromising on, but internal authenticity means fucking nothing to us. i don't know who i am or what my values are and i'm fine with that.

>Easier is less rewarding.
not in terms of making babies or having fun

>Has no one ever earned your respect in your life? Someone who has proven themselves to be competent?
no i don't really care about other people being competent. i just want to be competent myself. i don't care about other peoples competency level unless it's like my boss or something. if they struggle with it and ask me to help them with something, will though.

some people earn my respect, yeah.

>You *could* paint every person in the group with the same brush..but you shouldn't.
i don't like the thought process. i don't like the functions. i don't like NTJs. they don't mesh well with me and my thoughts. i want to fuck off and do my own thing and sometimes just hang out and talk about shit. most NTJs seem to always want to be doing something, or thinking about doing it rather than just talking about things for it's own sake. everything is purposeful with them. it's cold and annoying.

so what's your game here? why do you care if i want an NTJ or not?

>their armor cannot/will not be "broken".
Couldn't you say the same of INTPs, and to a lesser extent ISTPs?

He has a podcast and he is most definitely an ESFP.

Imagine being butthurt that people want to be involved with you.
Your problem isn't other people, your problem is that you're miserable and neurotic.

>INFJ
I prefer more introverted folks that are sensitive and passionate about something, preferably with politics like me. I want someone to have deep discussions with but also someone you can just cuddle all day if I'd like. And i want them to inspire me and be decently traditional. Maybe not one of those trad wife memes, but someone that loves tradition and nation and stuff like that.
Basically give me a female Oswald Mosley and I'm set forever

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i'm not butthurt. it's just fucking weird someone would get so booty blasted and enact so much anal armageddon because i said i don't like NTJs and wouldn't date one. it's like you, or the other person is convincing me to and it's just odd. i just said i wouldn't be with one for x and y reasons and it turned into a bit of an argument. feels like an NTJ woman mad that i don't like NTJ women but she likes INTPs and is just pissed about it, attempting to justify it to me. i don't even care.

i mean if i had a cute ENTJ girl in front of me wanting to fuck me i'd probably fuck her. i don't know about long term because like i said i don't enjoy the thought process. maybe you could make me less neurotic by getting on your knees for me, slut.

>Generally I think reliability is attractive to INTPs, but why is that? Tertiary Si?

No, it's their primary cognitive function. Whenever a type becomes absurdly in love with another person, it's because that other person is compatible with their primary function. Their primary function demands reliability.

So like we said earlier, in a relationship it's enamoring that no matter how many times they run the equation, they get the same answer every time. When they finish enough "practice runs" with small number factors, they'll take the same equation and put bigger numbers into it. Hence the "jumped out of a plane with no parachute and didn't die" scenario. They are then madly in love. They'd jump out of a plane again.

The tertiary function in a relationship will appear as either unhealthy responses to stress, or come up during times of play and intamacy(fantasy, fetishes, etc.). The times when this works to the INTP/ENTJ's advantage is if ENTJ happens to like displaying affection with physical contact.

kinda sucks waking up in a new world every 20 minutes.

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You mean that Ti seeks reliability? Isn't Te the function that demands perfect accuracy and reliable results?
>tertiary function
>intimacy
How does Si translate in an intimate context?

One day I hope for your sake you overcome being a nigger-tier coomer.
>muh dick
>must cum

so fucking anally annihilated

you sound like you need a nice orgasm to calm your nerves down, sweaty. maybe one day you can have some big chad INTP cock to calm it down for you.

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is anyone else in this thread an INTP musician? im curios to see any other INTP artists

i recorded this metal album with and INFJ bassist and an ENFP drummer

youtube.com/watch?v=AL7kcG4HY4s&t
we came together to record our old songs after our band leader died as sort of a tribute. i think he was an ENTJ? we made CD's and the people ive given them to say they love it.

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I guess all the isfp's died. this sucks

Correct.

I get what you're trying to say, but it's under the assumption that each function made its own system. Ti would try to calculate things, Te is trial and error.

Lmao found the Ni fag. When brute force fails, just use more brute force dork.

Stop.

>and the process-oriented aspect of it instead of Te's precise goal-oriented, efficient methodology

And that's exactly why the images should be switched. Because the Te function is focused on efficiency and the angles, it's focusing on HOW to get there, while Te is just focusing on getting there.

Ti seeks internal reliability, Te seeks external reliability. Ti is about things being done the right way each time, Te is about things producing the same results each time, even if a different method is used.

This is why xxTPs are actually more perfectionistic than xxTJs because Ti is so afraid of making mistakes that it leads to avoiding doing anything, it's pure analysis paralysis. It's going, if I don't get it right the first time, how will I be able to do it?

The reason why xNTJs are associated with demanding perfect accuracy is because of Te AND Ni working together, not just Te. Ni says, we can save ourselves the hassle of coming up with a solution in the future if we stick to what's reliable so far, only changing when something better comes along.

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Not you again, we told you you're an INFP, now fuck off and stop advertising your shitty channel here

Looks like you're just trying to convince yourself of your personal interpretation of this picture.

>Intj
>Esfp
>I want to reach my potential, by developing my lower functions