Whatever your feelings toward this game, whatever flaws it may have...

Whatever your feelings toward this game, whatever flaws it may have, the fact remains that Gambits are a fantastic system. Understand, I'm referring to the Gambit system, not the combat system. The combat has its flaws, but being granted direct modular control over AI party members' behavior is something more rpgs need and it's a shame almost no other games have attempted to improve and advance on the framework of what XII tried to do.

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junction system best system. prove me wrong.

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Under rated game for sure.

I personally just want to say that I fucking love the bestiary.

I love how vast the world is and how many secrets and quests it has
To me the feeling of running into an esper unexpectedly or to get into places with powerful enemies almost by accident has always been really cool to me. XII scratches that itch

The gambit system is an automation system that does not interfere with gameplay.
The combat system individually considered is the same of any other Final Fantasy game but with non-fixed character positioning.
People who complain about the former don't realize that the exact same system could be strapped onto every single other game in the mainline without problem, and people who complain about the latter are very silly unless they criticize the franchise as a whole for it.

People give the junction system shit but it probably would've been better received if it weren't tied to drawing magic, even though arguably that's what ties the junction system together.

Just wanna say I like you all anons

It's a beautiful intro to programming, as a kid I would spend ages figuring out new ways to set my party up to automate and execute strategies beyond Enemy -> Attack and Self < 70% -> Potion. The problem as with many Final Fantasies (and apparently Igavanias as well, I've come to learn) is that by giving the player so much freedom, the game is broken easily by fairly basic strategies and many players don't get challenged to explore the system deeper unless it really speaks to them on a more profound level.

Building on my previous note, my experience with FFVIII is less than 5 hours during which I converted all my Malboro cards into a Malboro tentacle and gave it to Quistis even before leaving Balamb Garden. I Status Effect Junctioned like 100 Death spells to Selphie so she had a 50% chance of KO'ing any enemy. Then I got bored of playing Triple Triad and called it there. The Junction System is amazing and gives players so many options, many of which appear to break the game from early on, but just like FFXII's Gambits, it can bore some players simply by being unbalanced.

It's fantastic. The amount of lore and worldbuilding it gives makes hunting down entries very compelling, and then you start realizing how screwed the world is.

It is my third favorite game in the whole franchise, and the story is very underrated even if I fully understand the people who say it doesn't fit the franchise it is part of

That's why I specifically stated I was referring only to Gambits, since people tend to conflate sub systems with combat systems. I personally have no issues with XII, or FF's combat in general, though I do feel XII's combat could've been tighter in spots, but since it was the first mainline title to move to real time movement/combat, it stands to reason there would be issues here and there.

It's a shame the entries for rare game suck though.

Counterpoint: why bother letting the party be AI controlled at all?

The biggest problem is that there's nothing to use it on, the enemies all die in one hit and bosses are too rare to focus on them, If perhaps battles had more enemies for longer periods of time, then the gambit system would be even better because you're teammates could actually effectively use status effects and conditionals rather than putting " " on everyone. But then I guess the combat would probably get more annoying too

You my nigga too.

The story just follows Matsuno's MO, he's been doing this shit since Tactics.

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Really the only problem is that the game doesn't put the player against such a challenge that they have to dive deeper in the gambit syustem and play with more layers of complexity in their strategy. Game's just too easy so most people just bothered with Attack X ennemy and heal under X HP and never looked further

Because if you're playing a party-based action rpg you want to make sure your party members are doing what they're supposed to be doing. I guess you could alleviate this problem by making only single character focused arpgs. But even outside of arpgs, direct control over party automation can still come in handy. Dragon Quest has let the player assign party members to AI for some time now, but is still limited to basic
>Attack
>Use Magic
>Heal
style commands as far as I know.

>Dude what if we made half the playable cast be inconsequential to the story
>Dude what if we made a cast that barely says anything and almost never interacts with each other
>Dude what if we made multiple cutscenes where the main character has no idea what's going on and just stands in the background while people who matter speak
>Dude what if we made a character who's literally just a random girl off the street
>Dude what if we made a villain who has zero emotional connection to the heroes and doesn't even meet them until the last ten minutes
>Dude what if we took Final Fantasy Tactics' setting and made it a poor man's Star Wars
>Dude what if we gave the narrator a comical Apu accent
>Dude what if we made a political plot and then ruined it by turning it into standard ancient god shenanigans
>Dude what if we made a plot where the heroes have almost no impact on what happens until 95% of the way through the story and spend their time traipsing through non-descript caves and ruins
>Dude what if I'm Captain Basch
>Dude what if we made the sheathing/unsheathing animation stop you before and after every battle
>Dude what if we took everything 100% seriously and had zero levity
>Dude what if we wrote all of the dialogue to sound like a Renaissance Fair
>Dude what if we we had no overworld and all travel was handled by a menu or floating teleport crystals
>Dude what if we made a battle system where you set everything up in advance so that you don't actually play the game
>Dude what if we made summons useless except for opening doors
>Dude what if instead of fun side quests we had only fetch/kill quests like in some generic MMO
>Dude what if instead of having fun side games like the motorcycle chase and Triple Triad we had nothing
>Dude what if we had really shitty music

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Enemies should have had their own gambits that they switch between. FFXII is a rather easy game and you can set up fairly universal gambits for most situations, if opponents adapted to your playstyles the game could have become much more interesting.

The fact that the game is set in Ivalice is just the cherry on top for me. It's weird to say but Ivalice really feels like home to me

I should go back to it, I was really enjoying it.

Absolutely

I can spend half a day wandering Rabanstre sometimes.

but other than that, it's a pretty good game, wouldn't you say?

>Enemies should have had their own gambits that they switch between.
Can imagine having debuffs that fuck with enemies gambits and have enemies and bosses act like retards. It would be like a deeper and more detailed version of confusion. You could have attacks that break or block certain gambits. FFXII's combat has so much potential.

The Switch version is the definitive version of Zodiac Age, right?

>is the version on the weakest system with no mod support the definitive edition?

the one thing I wish TZA didn't do was change the bestiary illustrations to just the model

>charm enemy
>they actually follow you around as a pseudo guest

What could've been.

I wonder why they changed it.

>shitty music
Oh you had to sneak that in there didn't you. Something tells me you're more interested in stiring shit than making any kind of valid argument.

Gambits deserve another game or two. Look how many turn based / ATB had to be refined.

Combat in JRPGs is a barrier to story. It should be as smooth and fun as possible.

Yes, then PC I think.

I hope you realize that's an old pasta you're responding to.

Love me some gambits.

Been playing Rimworld lately and noticed that you can automate tons of shit like gambits which is fun to do.

Any other games that have that sort of feel of setting shit up and watching it play out?

rollercoaster tycoon

That was basically my biggest issue with the game.
The abilities themselves were very lack luster as it all tend to lead int DPS type abilities since majority of mobs were immune to de-buffs anyways.

It was annoying how most of the end-game monsters were basically mobs who just casted every single negative element on you with just one spell, in hopes you had your gambits organized to resolve this quickly.

I enjoyed the system, but if only the game itself was more depth.

The only thing Switch has is the ability to make three gambit setups and maybe PC has that by now.

Factorio. Zachtronics games. Human Resources Machine too I guess.

i agree but the enemies aren't balanced for the gambit system

The gambit system is a crutch the game needs because you can't control your characters. It's better than just an AI you can't control, but it's worse than not controlling them yourself.
The way the real time combat system works with a 3rd person view with a controller meant that it was necessary though, but it's only necessary because of the bad premise FF12 created for itself.

>because you can't control your characters.
How’d you manage to fuck up your very first sentence?

Just cast Balance, bro.

Yeah but too bad shitters only want action combat from now on. We aren't allowed to have anything turn based or something like another FFXII ever again.

Yea, I remember at one point I tried to set things up so one character only cast magic, one never did any attacking but only buffing/debuffing style techs and spells, and only the leader doing straight physical attacks. Most commen enemies died before my mage and support could be of any use, and pretty much most bosses and hunts negated any usefulness the setup may have had.

Action combat can work, but I wouldn't rely on the FF teams for that.
Dragon's Dogma 2 with Gambit-controlled Pawns, when?

Are there any other JRPGs with dialogue and voice acting like this? It's sounds organic and they talk like actual people. I really like it.

>Action combat can work

That isn't the point, the point is we should have more variety. Too many games are similar to the last. JRPG how they once were have become much more niche and you only really see small budget games with that type of combat anymore.

>talk like actual people

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XII's localization is fairly unique.

What sort of system should be in place, then? Because party-based WRPGs has automation too.

Well, maybe wouldn't put it like he did but as far as FF games go and even among tons of games it does got some of the best VA I've ever seen in a game.

im playing through this for the first time now (second ff game) and i just beat the weird boss that was nothing but small enemies running away from you and casting status effects pretty much after the plains area on the way to archadia or something remotely similar sounding

how far into it am i

also the gambit system itself isnt a bad idea but the way its handled in the game is retarded with how you have to not only buy the gambit commands but unlock the slots which is all laughable on top of the first hurdle of accessing the right license and buying the proper thing (like the spell) that you would even want in the gambit in the first place

its a good system for the "active time battle" combat but the combat feels like a mouthbreather version of kotor or something to me

It's because they hired stage and theater actors instead of just doing the usual "pick off anime dubbers off the street."

>it's a shame almost no other games have attempted to improve and advance on the framework of what XII tried to do.
It looks like the new SAO game is going to do just that. youtu.be/X7yeaUw1ORY?t=113

also im ambivalent at best about vaan and i fucking hate penelo, why are they even in the game especially in their current roles and why the fuck is the plot so retarded and hard to follow

>how far into it am i

70%

really? pic related is pretty much my face 30 hours in after i started practically maining the 4x modifier speed mode somewhere between 20 and 25 hours because i only borrowed the game from the local library and kind of just want to get it done with even though ive started to like it much more the more the game has opened up with systems and abilities

FF7 was the only FF i had played and completed before this but the FF7remake demo made me want to play some of the other games so i borrowed this one and bought X/X-2 and XV from the local games store+ XII/ XII-2 on G2A for steam

obviously i forgot the pic since its 3am and i downed half a bottle

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