Now that's all said and done, which was the bigger disaster longterm?

YOU CANT JUST MAKE LUKE HAVE A HUMAN SIDE I WANTED TO HIM EXPLODE THE ATATs WITH HIS MIND. I WANTED REY TO BE A KENOBI

I just didn't want to be bored

TLJ killed a trilogy but brought down the whole cinematic universe with it. Also, it had something to build up from, they had the perfect cash grab and managed to ruin it, in the next film they even tried to fix it by annoying the few people who liked the previous train wreck. The whole thing is a mess.

JL is shit all the way and there was much hype for it, but still they were all fairly new characters(I mean this incarnation). It's something they can simpy retcon later. It didn't ruin Batman toys sales, you know. And it's not like you had 6 fairly decent DC universe films and then fucked up at some point. It was born dead.

The DCEU was always a disappointing nonstarter of a franchise. JL didn’t ruin anything because there was nothing to ruin. BvS and SS were worse and MOS is overrated.
The sequel trilogy tainted the originals by making the OG heroes pathetic failures. So it’s far far worse.

TLJ was pure unfiltered kino that only enrages literal autists. JL on the other hand was the cinematic equivalent of premature ejaculation. Absolutely no buildup of the DCEU made it unworthy of a teamup movie. It probably killed any idea of a well connected DC movie universe for at least 15 years. So yeah, I'd say JL was the bigger fuckup.

At this stage it's still JL. Both franchises had massive potential and goodwill at their disposal, JL dashed that immediately while the full effects of TLJ are still playing out as SW sputters along. The management surrounding SW is also even worse than DC's for both of their respective franchises, making it more difficult to lay all of it on TLJ.

When is the Snydercut going to drop?

TLJ or any sequel for the matter. The story was done and any sort of continuation about the skywalkers was destined to soil a decent saga for blockbuster standards. That's what the stupid fanboys get for demanding more meat of a dead horse. Well deserved.

JL dooming the dceu was like nothing of value was lost. It was a disaster from the get go.

Rise of Skywalker made it obvious to me JJ is the problem and not Rian. Rian had to deal with JJs mystery box shit and he took the flack for it.

they can always reboot capeshit
you can't reboot Star Wars without ruining the brand even more

How could one be disappointing by Justice League if there was no way to expect anything good?

Attached: laugh.jpg (602x468, 118.3K)

JL was a flop, BoP will follow. BvS underperformed. The Batman is its own thing and you have other bunch of retconned ideas like ww not hiding after his boyfriend died . Other franchises would just press the reset button but capeshit is very flexible so one or two flops won't ruin the whole picture unlike SW or Transformers. Hell, look at the foxmen "timeline".

>Rian had to deal with JJs mystery box shit
Actually, no, he didn't have to deal with it. That's why he didn't and gave the middle finger to the mystery boxes and all those stupid fan theories: He did the right thing and chose to get rid of the mystery boxes. Not his fault that so many fanboys fell for that meme - hook, line and sinker.
The only reason one would hate TLJ as intensely as those idiots do, is that one fully bought into Abrams' shit. And you can't possible cater to those. They're a LOST cause (pun intended).

The one that crashed the biggest franchise in film history, as opposed to the one that left a half-assed cinematic universe limping in a half-dead state.
Capeshitters are retarded.

Star Wars. They had the opportunity to give a great closure to the Skywalkers with most of the actors alive. They blew it. You can't recover from that. Perhaps in many decades if someone resets the whole thing, but I'd think that it will take many reset attempts until they find a cast as significant as the original, if it's ever possible.
Superheroes, on the other hand, come and go. They murdered the Batman franchise in 1997 and everyone thought that was it. Less than a decade later Nolan did a very acclaimed film with Batman and the interest resurfaced immediately. Warner can always end the current franchise, wait a few years, and if they hire the right people they can be reborn again. Star Wars can't.

No lie we prob wouldn't have Joker if JL didn't happen

Do you consider that a good or a bad thing? I mean, Joker does have its fans, after all.

TLJ poisoned the entire Star Wars brand. DC has seen success after Justice League. TROS hasn't even made more than Joker, never mind Aquaman. This isn't even up for debate, TLJ did much more damage.

That's like asking whether super AIDS is worse than having a badger gnaw off your dick and balls then go for your carotid.

They are equally shit.

Justice League was followed up by Aquaman, which made well over a billion dollars in spite of all the shit surrounding the DCEU's reputation.
Point is, DCEU wisely chose to scale back their ambitions and just make stand-alone movies. They now have some legs at least and are in a much better position to actually compete with the next MCU phase in the post 2020 era.

TLJ reduced SW to a streaming service show.

The damage isn't even comparable.

Both are awful, but I'd rather watch TLJ desu

I'd rather watch Justice League because it's shorter

TLJ.

After TLJ, Disney started getting worried and then panicked when Solo did disastrously. Then it led to the disaster of Rise of Skywalker. Simultaneously a lot of projects were getting canceled.

After Justice League, Aquaman (which still used Momoa who was introduced in Justice League) still did well which showed that the taint of Justice League didn't affect Aquaman the way the taint of TLJ affected Solo and Rise of Skywalker.

>Makes more than the finale of what was once the biggest franchise on the planet that had a $2 billion film just 5 years before
No, no I'm sure Justice League did more damage

Attached: d12d947cc981d7520dbcd96cf5daaf5d.jpg (1200x1500, 430.5K)

And even though I didn't like Snyder's films, the demand for the Snyder Cut for Justice League actually sounds convincing unlike the demand for the JJ cut of Rise of Skywalker. The former felt like a director genuinely wanting people to understand he had a specific vision for it while the latter felt like some kind of damage control.

Keep in mind TLJ is meant to be comparable to a trilogy/9 movie franchise. DCEU is meant to be comparable to the entire MCU. Going by the success of the MCU and the DCEU's failure to replicate it due to BvS and JL, it's the bigger hypothetical failure. It's not just the JL movie itself being a failure, it's the DCEU's hypothethical equivalent of Black Panther, Captain Marvel, GotGm and even JL2 and JL3 never getting made because of how bad JL was.

Justice League just because warner bros has more to loose than Disney and Star Wars despite being awful makes its money back in spades. Disney has the money to risk it again and release more, WB isn’t gonna touch justice league for years, maybe decades

DC in all of its forms is used to bad takes and retcons. The characters are 70-80 years old, their brand is cemented regardless of flops and disappointments.
Star Wars is relatively younger but similarly cemented. Star Wars as a whole will continue, though it will feel the pain for quite a while as the brand, aside from the jump to nu-canon, has been mostly intact its entire run, compared to the many many iterations of batman, superman, etc.
It comes down to the perspective of fans. TLJ has polluted star wars as a whole, while JL is just a movie in a long line of questionable DC iterations, like Batman and Robin.

When's the next Star Wars movie coming out?

>DCEU's hypothethical equivalent of Black Panther, Captain Marve,l GotGm
Wonder Woman and Aquaman and Suicide Squad?

Remember when this was supposed to happen in January this year?

Attached: 1580525174710.jpg (720x940, 321.53K)

I dunno man but probably in between 10 Disney plus Star Wars shows and another “star wars story” picture. When do you think they’ll touch the justice league again?

>WB isn’t gonna touch justice league for years, maybe decades
How do you figure when they are actively developing almost all of those characters, and are going to use some of the solo movies as a springboard to launch right back into a team-up movie?

>and another “star wars story” picture.

Where?

Nobody had any hope for JL
SW was an incredible lesson on how to destroy a franchise.

>probably in between 10 Disney plus Star Wars shows
So it's been relegated to streaming and they can't even get Obi Wan off the ground. Meanwhile DC is still releasing films in their universe with sequels to Wonder Woman, Aquaman and Shazam

Most of those characters haven’t failed monumentally before (save for Harley Quinn kek) not to mention 2 or 3 times.

I mean how many Star Wars shows are being developed on Disney plus? I’m not saying I know for sure or anything it’s just that it seems the crux of the justice league are specifically out of WBs grasp, whereas Disney could pump out a obi wan or Luke skywalker prequel film/ tv show and despite it probably being shit, would make them a shit ton of money. Again man I could be wrong I’m not trying to defend Disney it’s just my hunch

Hate on the Force Awakens all you want, but it did a fine job setting up a new trilogy. Last Jedi was the time to play it riskier, and do new things, but instead of that they fucked up pretty much everything they set up in the last movie. Which is fine if you set up new stuff, but they don't do that either. It's the cinematic equivalent of doing improv with a guy that just says "no" to everything you say. It doesn't give your audience any reason to want to see what'll happen next, which made them say "fuck it, let's bring Palpatine back".
People shit on JJ for that but they really had no choice after TLJ. And I'll be shocked if they continue to allow writer-directors to be a thing in their movies after this. It's the kind of thing that's had huge long-term repercussions and we'll probably still be feeling the damages of it in the future.

On the other hand, Justice League was just another shitty DC movie, which we already had plenty of by that point.

>whereas Disney could pump out a obi wan or Luke skywalker prequel film/ tv show and despite it probably being shit, would make them a shit ton of money.

You mean like Solo?

>TLJ killed a trilogy
Disagree. Remember, TLJ is a sequel to an entire saga.

Call me when they announce another Superman movie, or a Batman movie that’s connected to the rest of the DCEU

Wonder Woman and Suicide Squad were made before Justice League. Also Suicide Squad is shit. I don't feel like looking it up but I'm sure Aquaman and Shazam were already far into production to cancel at that point, so I don't think JL's failure would get them canned. I would say Pattinson's Batman is going to be the first movie to really test if DCEU can be salvaged.

>whereas Disney could pump out a obi wan or Luke skywalker prequel film/ tv show and despite it probably being shit, would make them a shit ton of money.
Could they? Are you forgetting that Solo bombed or that the Obi Wan show has been delayed and most likely cancelled?

>Wonder Woman and Suicide Squad were made before Justice League
And both are having sequels. And so are Aquaman and Shazam. You've got nothing

>The Batman
That movie is not connected to the DCEU.
This Wonder Woman sequel will be a real test.
If they can't get people interested in these characters enough to successfully make at least two profitable films with the same/similar actors, then they have failed and will never be able to do what Marvel did/is doing for each character.

Attached: 1580276163920.jpg (512x600, 85.35K)

Completely valid that solo was a bomb that hurt the prospect of future Star Wars movies, I just personally think man of steel, BVS and JL together make the studio more wary, especially with the financial risks being greater with WB

>especially with the financial risks being greater with WB
WB isn't exactly a studio on the edge. They're owned by AT&T so they aren't hurting for cash

JL ruined an already underperforming franchise that had been underperforming since its inception.
TLJ ruined Star Wars. Motherfucking Star Wars. How do you fuck that up?

>Hate on the Force Awakens all you want, but it did a fine job setting up a new trilogy.
No it didn't. It set up nothing. Retards like you excuse shit writing and filmmaking from JJ just because you were too stupid to see through his shit and instead blame TLJ for not being the giant fanwank you expected.

>People shit on JJ for that but they really had no choice after TLJ.
And this is the next fallacy. TLJ actually set upo things, like Kylo Ren being the big bad. They could have worked with that. The Trevorrow script draft did. That your favourite director Abrams lacks the creativity to do anything other than bring back things from the OT is not Rian Johnson's fault.

Aquaman made 75 million more globally than the final film in the new SW trilogy. One of the craziest things I've heard in a long time

nuWars's biggest mistake was having so much of the old cast involved so heavily. THey should have been around but only here and there.

This. You don’t give a cook stale ingredients and expect a fresh meal. Rians not a good film maker by any stretch but still

TLG. Batman/superman/justice league is an easy reboot. you can't reboot star wars

>Most of those characters haven’t failed monumentally before
Superman 4 killed off live action superman for 19 years, and Superman Returns wasn't a great hit either.
As said earlier, Batman & Robin killed off live action Batman for 11.
Aquaman is a recurring joke of a character in modern times, and has never had a success to his name beyond animated straight-to-dvd movies. Never had a live action appearance aside from a pilot episode in '06 that was scrapped. Had to immediately ride the coattails of a flop like Justice League.
And despite all that, it did gangbuster numbers. That definitely proves the damage JL did isn't going to be sustained for long.

BvS, not JL, is what killed the DCEU. So in terms of bad

BvS > TLJ > JL

I think that's what hurts Star Wars the most. If Disney tried to reboot the original trilogy it would be seen as sacrilege and nobody would see it.

snyder cut will more than compensate for that shitty jl disney cut. just wait and see

I hope you’re right user, id much rather see another justice league attempt than any more Star Wars, I just don’t think that’s how it’s gonna go.

>As said earlier, Batman & Robin killed off live action Batman for 11.

It was 8 years, Batman Begins was released in 2005. And people that claim Justice League is a bigger disaster than TLJ forgot how bad it was when Batman and Robin flopped, they lost confidence in doing superhero movies for a while, started up some projects that got stalled until they got Batman Begins.

Tlj destroyed the whole Star Wars franchise that had been building up for almost half a century. The DC universe is still alive and kicking, it can just reinvent itself whenever it wants. Look at how many iterations if Batman we’ve had. Fpwp.

Now that you mention it, thinking back to all the past decades ... was there ever a capeshit film (or live action series) that was genuinely good from a writing or filmmaking perspective?

>If Disney tried to reboot the original trilogy it would be seen as sacrilege
They already did with TFA, and the majority of "fans" ate it up like the sheep they are.

Sure.