NEW YORK PUNK

I've been thinking about the development of New York punk, and it seems like it happened in 6 waves (comment if you can contribute to what happened after the 6th).

1st wave: Rock bands influenced by Beat Poetry, as well as the protests and social issues happening in New York and around the country, like Stonewall. Very influenced by the art scene of the 60s. The Velvet Underground, The Fugs. Involved Andy Warhol.

2nd wave: after the hippie era died and the art scene was in decline, people were continuing subversive art without the backing of the larger art world. New York Dolls, Suicide, figures connected with the art scene like Deborah Harry (Warhol groupie, formed Blondie) and Wayne County (Warhol drag queen, formed the Electric Chairs).

3rd wave: Attracted by bands like the Velvet Underground and the New York Dolls, a new scene forms from kids wanting to set up their own new artsy music scene, inspired by what came before. Ramones, The Dictators, Television, Richard Hell & The Voidoids, Dead Boys, Talking Heads, Mink DeVille, Patti Smith, Jim Carroll. Involved Anthony Bourdain

4th wave: bands from previous wave either found success and went on tour, or fell apart from heroin addictions, so the scene declined. People left over want to make more radical, abrasive, experimental music. James Chance, DNA, Rosa Yemen, Mars, Teenage Jesus & The Jerks, Theoretical Girls, ESG. Involved Steve Buscemi and Jim Jarmusch.

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5th wave: Inspired by hardcore happening elsewhere, New York street kids form a small scene about the serious social issues, crime, drug problems of New York city, while reflecting their own tough living conditions. Agnostic Front, Cro-Mags, Beastie Boys, Warzone. Outside of that, experimental bands like Sonic Youth and Band of Susans form. Involved Jocko Willink.

6th wave. Previous wave starts getting into crossover thrash, which leads to bands like Biohazard, Sick of It All, Madball, Life of Agony, Carnivore. New generation of hardcore kids don't like the metal direction or nihilism of those bands, and inspired by straight edge bands like 7 Seconds and those in DC and Boston, form the Youth Crew - Youth of Today, Gorilla Biscuits, Judge, who led to post-hardcore bands like Quicksand and “krishnacore” like Shelter, 108. Outside of that, bands influenced by British anarcho scene form like Nausea and Missing Foundation.

But you can cut that down to 3 waves, it just depends on the time frame you’re using, also why feel the need to mention that certain celebs were “involved”

PPS: I just saw your thread, and I just saw it get 404d, did you delete or did some nanny accidentally delete it, that was strange.

Hey - I deleted it because I wanted to make an edit.
I only added celebrities so people less familiar with the scene had someone they could connect it with.

I suppose you're right, that the first two are basically proto-punk art rock, the second two are the original NY punk scene, and the last two are NYHC.

Yep. I’ve personally classified the punk movement from East to west coast and overseas in 3 waves, seems simpler. But honestly most people these days don’t give a shit about punk or anything close to it, hell maybe they never did. But I think that’s a good thing myself, the more people to like something, the more shit that usually gets heaped on the pile. I’m more of a west coast guy myself. California’s punk scene seemed so much more abrasive and advanced compared to the New York scene.

My favorites are
>the germs
>dead Kennedys
>fear
>X
>the screamers
>black flag
>the bags
>x ray spex
>the urinals
>black randy
>the bags
>dr know
Etc etc

looks pretty good to me, i feel 2nd wave and 3rd wave have a lot of overlap though. I'm assuming you've read Please Kill Me? check it out if you haven't

Nice. I definitely prefer east coast, both New York and DC, but I love that early LA punk scene with the Germs, X, Circle Jerks, etc. It's both intense and artsy. When hardcore really got going, though, the later West Coast hardcore bands didn't really click with me, and I never really liked Cali pop punk, but I love the focused, experimental hardcore that came out of New York and DC. I also love that early bohemian punk scene with people like Richard Hell/Television and Jim Carroll.

Never got into The Bags, but I've always meant to because I've always really liked Alice Bag's interviews.

I also like the British anarcho/crust/grind scenes.

I have, it's a cool book! For that era, I also really like The Velvets to the Voidoids, and also Richard Hell's autobiography, I Dreamed I was a Very Clean Tramp, which is honestly just beautifully written.

meant to quote

Have you read the book "Please Kill Me" by Eddie "Legs" McNeil and Jillian McCain?

It's basically an oral history of the New York punk scene told by those who were there. There are numerous quotes from the people you mentioned including Lou Reed, Andy Warhol, Wayne/Jane County, etc.

Your post is quite accurate, and if you really want to dig deeper into what the scene was like, I think you will thoroughly enjoy this book.

Thanks!

This has already been documented ad nauseam in tons of books and documentaries. Are you trying to look smart or just regurgitating stuff you've seen and read from people that actually experienced this first hand? Either way, absolutely pointless diatribe.

No, parts of it have been documented. The point of my post is to link all of this - for one thing, there's a very notable disconnect between people who usually talk about the original punk scene, and the hardcore scene.

I'm not "trying to look smart," I'm enthusiastic about this music and have been for a long time.

Also, you misused the term diatribe, you should try to learn what it means. But keep being a whiny little bitch about people discussing music on a music board.

You're a kook. And your bitter rant is indeed a diatribe. And a pointless one at that. You should make a thread about how rock and roll ripped off the blues, nobody's has done that yet either.

You're a retard. There's nothing bitter about my post, it's completely celebratory. I literally like every single one of the waves I described a lot, especially the original punk scene and the youth crew scene. You're literally just a whiny retard.

You're a fucking zoomer that just discovered punk and hardcore and now, like every other zoomer faggot, you feel the need to let everyone know about it. Nobody cares about you. Everything you wrote has already been written. Anybody that isn't a poser already knows this shit. You have nothing new to say. You're just eating and shitting out other people's shit. It's pointless. You're pointless.

lol imagine sperging out this much.

I'm in my late 20s. I've been into punk since I was 11. I've read the books, met the people, gone to the shows. I wrote all this because I'm enthusiastic about the music.

You're literally unable to comprehend the tone of what I wrote, which was completely positive. You're also too fucking stupid to understand the point of my post, which is categorization. You could make the point you just made about literally anything anyone writes about anything second hand - if you weren't there to experience every single thing yourself, then you're repeating what someone else said, but in your own way.

You should honestly kill yourself, you stupid little asshole. You're too fucking stupid and whiny to exist.

>gone to the shows
LOL no you haven't. Punk was cool. It's too bad you missed it.

based enthusiastic bro

whats your problem?

OP

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thanks MK

i like your thread(s)
maybe add some music and hope the discussion rolls nicely

what a couple of namefaggots

Hey pal. Don't worry about these bozos, I liked your post.

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samefagging

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post some music

thanks bro

youtube.com/watch?v=N7CgxfCoVuE

I like your post.

Also second the recommendation on "Please Kill Me". Maybe the best music book ever

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kisses bb

The Bags aren't everybody's taste, but if you're interested in what was going on in L.A. between 77-80, The Bags were a really good band, right up there with X, The Germs, The Weirdos, and all the rest of the bands that you probably know, if only by name.

I actually met Alice Bag a while back, when her autobiography Violence Girl came out. She was ver nice, and super friendly, which took me by surprise considering how rough and abrasive The Bags' music was. If you like first generation L.A. punk, then check them out. You won't be sorry.

Yeah, I know, right?
Somebody actually contributes something POSITIVE on Yas Forums about the first generation of N.Y. Punk, and it's roots, and some troll has to come around and be a total shithead about things.

Best not to feed the trolls.

I think OP's thread is quite good. They seem to know their history and have a genuine love of the music. Shame there isn't a time machine so he can actually travel back to those days, but their heart is certainly in the right place.

And that troll you're responding to should either contribute something positive, or just fuck off, because ass hats like that are what's ruining Yas Forums. They definitely need to get a life.

I mean geeze, I know everybody's going stir crazy from being quarantined because of Covid-19, but seriously, WTF? Are the so bored and jaded from viewing the same gay porn sites over and over again at this point? Is there nothing good on television to watch? Have they exhausted the whole Netflix library? Talk about needing to get a life.....

says the samefagging faggot pretending to be at least 3 different people in this shit thread.