DOOM Thread

It wasn't heaven. It was some alien race "Pretending" to be heaven. The real heaven have nothing to do with this.

Except they didn't? Despite the Heaven and Hell shit in the series, neither are really rooted in Christian/Catholic. Demons and Maykrs are just interdimensional aliens

So who is Seraphim exactly? It's pretty clear that Hayden is him, but it's not exactly clear who he is. He can't be Maykr, cause they are hivemind. Was he the one who made The Father disappear or did he make VEGA to make his own version of The Father?

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I'm pretty certain we'll get a fight against Hayden in the next one. He's basically the human version of Khan Makyr and Eternal went out of it's way to make it clear that the use of Argent energy leads to evil and what not. There are clear parallels between The Sentinels/Makys and the Humans/Hayden since Hayden is essentially non human at this point and is basically a god to them as the Makyrs were to the Sentinels.

Yes but if you're not convinced, wait for the DLC's and a GOTY repackage.

why would i play a game for children

There's no "real heaven", it's pretty clear that the whole shebang about Hell / Heaven was due to the influence of the Maykr and Hell lords. The only true god is The Father, maybe

only the maykr drones are hivemind, theres another sect called angel maykrs

Anyone else feel like New Doomguy is really overdesigned? Both in 2016 & eternal. Yeah they have the classic suit but it's sloppily done

>He can't be Maykr, cause they are hivemind.
Actually he is. Despite the hivemind, the codex states that Maykrs have individual thoughts and personalities. They cannot disobey the Khan. The Seraphim is the apparent exception, be it by design or flaw. VEGA implied to be only a part of The Father, who was both organic and machine. The origin, fate, and even details of what The Father is are shrouded in mystery

Lets say you could only get Doom Eternal or FFVII Remake... which do you get?

I think the codex is pretty clear on this, unless I'm interpreting "a shared consciousness" wrong

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Other entries specify that Maykrs still retail individuality, they just cannot go against their chosen Khan. There's even a caste system, higher rank Maykrs whom have earned "halos"

Support id, user. Buy the deluxe edition.

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the torrent is free homie, but I would have payed for it If I had more money

Fair enough

Baphomet boss when?

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death to all imps

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why would you complain about a game for children

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Can we take a minute to address the fact that the main antagonist, The Khan Maykr, offered to revive Doomguy's rabbit in exchange for him not to kill the final Hell Priest?

Thats an apples vs oranges situation. FFVII may be longer if length is important to you.

Didn't fall for it, either. You consort with demons you get the boomstick. 'ate demons, 'ate worshipers, 'ate argent energy, simple as.

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>Daisy Icon of Sin is the final boss

Doom Eternal is definitely worth 60 dollars. It's got a 20 hour campaign (10 hour if you're not a completionist) and quite a bit of replayability. However, you can't convince me that whatever dlc campaigns down the line are worth adding an extra 30 bucks to that price tag.

We still need Mother Demon.

reminder to the kids that OG doom is still worth playing

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I kind of want the sequel to show Doomguy rebuilding the Night Sentinels, perhaps even become their new warrior king. They were enslaved, manipulated, thinking they were still the great guardians of creation when in reality their holy priests and gods were in bed with demons.
I want the DLC to give Doomguy a bunny, either ghost Daisy or a new one he rescued on Earth. The empty rabbit cage in his room is so sad

>tried to turn around and go back
>nothing happened
Was kinda disappointed desu

Well we still don't know what the fuck the wraiths are yet, or who made the makyrs.

>still worth playing
>all this work to make it worth playing

The explain The Wraiths. They were subterranean creatures of immense power who were the original gods of The Night Sentinels. They had power similar to Argent, and they gave power to the people. When the Maykrs showed up, they essential lost favor, and were kept hidden away for safe keeping. Later after a few Night Sentinels discovered the soul factory, they called upon the Wraiths for strength to overthrow the Maykrs. That's when the Hell Priests deceived The Betrayer, stole the Wraiths, trapped the rebellion in Hell, created The Icon of Sin, and essentially created The Well from 2016 from Wraith Energy

makin my first ever doom map while in corn teen
pretty comfy desu

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>or who made the maykrs
its quite explicitly "the Father", whoever that is, he created them

I just beat doom 1 and it's pretty weird in that episode 1 is the best and then it goes downhill really fucking fast.
Sigil was pretty good too tho

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Can someone explain how Samuel Hayden is supposedly a maker when his whole human backstory is fleshed out in 2016? Sounds like a bunch of bullshit fanwank.

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Well then where the fuck did he come from?

>Sounds like a bunch of bullshit fanwank
Welcome to Doom Eternal. I was pretty disappointed, too.

No, I'm saying Eternal is not communicating that and fans are inserting their fanfiction into the story.

>Doom, the Cyberdemon and the Spider Mastermind only show up in their respective boss fight levels
>Doom II, the Cyberdemon and Spider Mastermind are uncommon enemies but appear in multiple maps
>Doom 2016, same as Doom
>Doom Eternal, the Cyberdemon shows up as an uncommon enemy in the Tyrant but the Spider Mastermind is completely absent

don't give me a lecture on the arachnotrons they're completely different

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Hayden in 2016 literally says the exact same line that the Seraphim tells the slayer when he puts him in the divinity machine

here's a pity (You)

Can you really not think of another situation where a divine being crossed dimensions into our world to become human and save mankind? Is that concept really so foreign to you? Doesn't that ring a bell at all?

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The Seraphim has the same voice actor doing the same voice and says the same thing to Doomguy that Hayden says in 2016 ("Take it. It will give you strength. Help you on your journey"). Hayden also knows all about Urdak, Hell, and the Night Sentinels, more than he should if he were human.

What are you proposing then? That a makyr made a human body and lived out a human life on earth in some random timeline? For all we know it's a callback. And yes I'm aware it's also the same voice actor but that's not enough solid evidence.

Hayden could have gotten corrupted by the crucible between the games or when he got into the hell to begin with. Maybe he didn't just free the doomguy alone, but the Seraphim. Either way, Samuel Hayden as an actual UAC director is no more, maybe he never was one to begin with.

I only turned around to see if there was a spectral Daisy behind you.

The power of retconning.
It's simply not possible for Hayden to be a human while also knowing everything about the maykrs, knowing that VEGA would be able to open a portal out of urdak, telling the slayer that he can save HIS world etc.

Bruh it is not hard to figure that somebody like Hayden could conceivably make a false identity, reincarnate as a human, however you want to reason he changed identities over time from Samur to Sam Hayden. This story does not need to spell out absolutely everything and leave absolutely no questions, there isn't a story in the world that does that.

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It's possible that Samuel has a soft spot for humanity after meeting Doomguy. To break away from the Khan Maykr, to disobey, is heresy. He likely wanted free will, and chose to become human. Though over time, its clear his morals became even more questionable, justifying using the same energy the Maykrs used to save their people, with the exact same argument of "Its for the greater good"

Hayden called it Argent Energy back in 2016 too, a name he couldn't possibly have known without knowing about Argent D'nur to name it after. I don't think it's as much of a retcon as people are saying.

Well 2016 made it clear that the UAC discovered Argent D'nur at the very least. I Definitely think this is a retcon.

>mfw first playthrough on nightmare mode
>mfw realise no ammo reloading only rip and tear

So basically you have to fight to kill
Interesting concept for a shooter
Game is nothing like Doom 3

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Eternal's story and implementation seems so half-assed.
They should fuck off with these third parties and have doom guy go after some of the big bads of hell.

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How is it a retcon? Hell had tablets documenting their war with Argent D'Nur, and describe what Argent is

The main problem with Eternal is it tried to answer every single question that 2016 laid out and it bloated the plot. If they were smart they wouldn't have even introduced the Khan Makyr at all until the third game, unless they weren't even planning on making a trilogy. Also the Makyrs didn't seem nearly as powerful and threatening as they are because of this.

I'm pretty sure that's what they said the DLC will be, but now I can't find a source for that.

Doom II didn't have the mastermind as an enemy, that was the arachnatron.

I'm saying it's a retcon that Hayden is supposedly a makyr because in 2016 he would know it's called Argent D'nur even if he was just a normal human, because they discovered the tablets in their expeditions.

Eternal's mostly just going over Doom 2's excuse-plot (demonic invasion of Earth) and chasing over some of the plot-threads from 2016, most importantly Doomguy and that he unquestionably is Doomguy from the original games. Unless there's a Doom 64 retread and he goes after a demon mother there's nowhere to really go with the plot besides going after bigger and badder demons, probably push Hayden's shit in some more.

Yeah, I think it definitely needed more spacing and time. Urdak was a huge disappointment just fighting demons like usual with just one new enemy type. If the demons were there, they should have gone all out and show hell devouring urdak as you go through it.

Yes it did, MAP06: The Crusher had a mastermind you crush with a switch.

Doom II has plenty of Spider Masterminds, 5 on Ultra-Violence
you didn't forget the map that started with the Cyberdemon and Mastermind fighting did you?

Hayden's body is clearly maykr design, and there is a pretty big difference in him knowing about argent d'nur and knowing about urdak. You guys are also completely ignoring the fact he literally stole VEGA from the maykrs.

My theory is that Samuel Hayden did exist, but actually died of his brain cancer and that the Seraphim then pretended to be him in a new body in order to gain control of the UAC. Doing this so he could use argent energy again in order to strengthen humanity to prepare against the maykrs.
That way it's not a retcon while still making sense.

It had both. Off the top of my head, the Mastermind was in Gotcha, Barrels O' Fun, and The Crusher.

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>That way it's not a retcon while still making sense.

That's literally the definition of a retcon, just a less bad one.