Libertarians

You can make companies financially responsible for pandemics and as such will work to prevent them in the first place or limit their spread.

Self ownership contradicts slavery, one cannot completely own themselves and be completely owned at the same time.
The non aggression principle is based on self ownership.
The non agression principle is against slavery.

You don't own anything with a government. Expropriation, recurring taxes...it's all usufruct when you think about it.

>children are starving in the streets
>offer them a better life with 3 warm meals a day, shelter, warm clothes, everything they didn't have before
>all they have to do is serve in your military

there you go, "voluntary" "slavery"

Who’s to enforce the NAP anyway?
>”don’t enter my property”
>”no”
>”WHAT THE FUCK?! YOU JUST VIOLATED THE NAP! IM GONNA BLOW YOUR FUCKING HEAD O-“*BOOM*
>”shut the fuck up boomer, my turf now”

>all they have to do is serve in your military
You do know most of the time with such cases in the real world they end up becoming prostitutes

>Involuntary slavery

Ancap libertardians.

You guys really are something.

universal private property
a person without any property is already violating property rights by existing, no one is obliged to do anything for them.
so they already owe you rent or a toll just for merely being present, how will they pay for that?
obviously they will need to work off that debt, in the mean time they will need food and shelter, also needs to be compensated for, ergo they must be compelled to work until they can buy their freedom

Lolbergs are too dumb OP. They don't even have the awareness to see that lolbergism is a joke ideology. Don't bully them, they're completely helpless

Well our ideas of "ownership" fundamentally come from the statism of "private property". With no government, you have no private property. Property is only "private" because the state makes a promise to protect it for you in exchange for your payment into their economic system.

The NAP is a frame of laws, laws by themselves don't have enforcement, it's up to society and markets to enforce these laws.

The NAP is simply the minimum set of laws required for civilization to prosper in a peaceful manner, every successful civilization in history has the NAP as base in one way or another.

The NAP is a emergent property of co-operation being better for everyone than coercion, not something thats "enforced".

>The NAP is a emergent property of co-operation being better for everyone than coercion
must be 18 years old to post

>taxes help the economy

Ok bootlicker, imagine this scenario. Your neighbor, whom you've developed a friendship with over the last 5 years, has a tree fall from their yard, into your yard, and it completely demolishes your large backyard shed. Also, the police said they are super backed up, and won't be able to do an incident report for at least 3 months.

WHAT DO YOU DO?! Do you blow of your friends head, just because his property destroyed yours? I know, how about take your friend's entire family hostage, until he gives you the money for a new shed, in cash.

fuuuuuuuuck. Smoke some weed or listen to some Eastern Philosophy or something. You're too far inside the box.

>How much statist coercion is allowed to stop the spread of Coronachan without running afoul of the NAP?
None, and there wouldn't be a need to begin with because private companies develop vaccines faster and don't need to be subjected to government regulation so people desperate for the vaccines can get it much quicker, and companies in real life give a shit ton of money to prevent trending diseases

Also, private neighborhoods, cities, etc are allowed to restrict people's movement to begin with, they wouldn't be nowhere near as incompetent as the States in preveting the virus spread

>Voluntary slavery
YOU
CAN'T
MAKE
THIS
SHIT
UP

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Voluntary slavery was common in the past.

What's that buddy? I don't understand what you mean by this. Are YOU saying taxes help the economy? Or are you saying that I said taxes help the economy? Sorry, I just don't understand, and I don't know where you would have gotten such an idea from my comment that you wrote this in reply to

You need a IQ higher than 80 to make a real argument

Define “coercion”

AnCaps are antislavery to the point of autism. There are thousands of valid arguments against those weebs but you commie dipshits always go with the slavary.

So assuming I have a big 5-year old sex slave militia, I can basically just kill some cunt if I want, rape his wife, and take over his property and nobody can stop me because of my superior firepower?

>’m-muh NPA in prehistoric societies!’
We also generally had chieftains or councils who enforced it. Sometimes they were overthrown by chads of superior strength but that’s not really the case.

Private property is a construct in the same way self-ownership is,

From your argument one could deduce that self-ownership is impossible without a government. I digress, the market is not a government and can offer ways to guarantee your private property and your self-ownership in the same way the state does, with the barrel of a gun.

>Who’s to enforce the NAP anyway?
youtube.com/watch?v=M8xSCzggWe8
People, basically

In the end this argument of "i can't imagine how the market can do it so the State has to exist" is useless, as the main reason for ancapism is ethics, like slavery it didn't matter the economical consequences or how would the country live without slaves, it was wrong and it needed to end

Not me, but some nig or beaner with an army of 5-year old sex militiaboys might need a new facility for his methlab, so why not get one for the price of a dozen 12-gauge shells instead of spending days building a new one?

>With no government, you have no private property.
huh?
dailyanarchist.com/2015/03/11/the-anarchist-republic-of-cospaia/
What drugs are you using? It lasted longer than the USA even

Yes.

but ultimately its not in your self interest because thieving cultures will not be able to produce as much as cultures that respect private property and eventually that culture will steal your shit.

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you have no argument, you have an ideology that itself prohibits the imposition of that ideology and has not mechanism to enforce it.
it does not even reach the level of retarded.

>So assuming I have a big 5-year old sex slave militia, I can basically just kill some cunt if I want, rape his wife, and take over his property and nobody can stop me because of my superior firepower?

Well as you can imagine I've dealt thousands of times with this dumb ass argument that anyone could think of if that was the first time you're introduced to a different paradigm.

Your capability of taking over others properties is dependent on yours and others firepower, and this applies equally in both a world of anarcho capitalism and in a world of statism. Germany took over France, guess they should have tried not to be ancaps, right?

Right now you're an involuntary slave to the State you idiot, since it makes others have rights you have an obligation of working to give then their rights, also taxation, if you dont pay like a good slave you're getting in prison

>Voluntary slavery

Believe you me, it’s possible, believe you me lol

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Well I’m all for private property but I see the necessity for a framework enforced by an authority, and not just accepted by a society.
Especially if there are external or internal threats to such framework.
A small military might not be able to stand up to a superior enemy, but I firmly believe in the rights to bear arms, so if the civilians population lose too, then FUG :DDDD

>So assuming I have a big 5-year old sex slave militia
You need to realize you live in the real world, if my city was privitized people like you wouldn't be allowed to enter or make trade because slavery and pedophilia would be prohibited, peoppe don't suddenly have mass amnesia and forget all their values because the State stopped existing and people want freedom

But fine let's assume your case
>I can basically just kill some cunt if I want, rape his wife, and take over his property and nobody can stop me because of my superior firepower
Sure, but that would make you eligible to, at the very least, economical sanctions, at mire realistically people would shoot you and no one would bat an eye

What happens if your owned slave kills someone else and violate the NAP on your behalf?

>Well I’m all for private property but I see the necessity for a framework enforced by an authority, and not just accepted by a society.

Have you considered the concept of private cities?

Well that's not "ownership". That's just a temporary possession. There is no "ownership" of anything without a government. Not yourself, not others. There is no concept of "ownership" without the state. IDK why this is hard for people to understand. I mean, you can "possess" things, but you're not gonna "own" them. If you build a house and mix your labor with the land, then go on a vacation for a week to Hawaii and come back, other people can have claimed that house, and nothing you can do about it other than fight like a retarded ape for "his" territory, because you don't "own" anything without statism.

>We also generally had chieftains or councils who enforced it
Nope, there have been examples using just arbitrage (the current private justice system)
dailyanarchist.com/2015/03/11/the-anarchist-republic-of-cospaia/

And your argument doesn't make sense, even if there was a council, they didn't enforce it, it was all voluntary

Yeah there's no private property without a government. I'm not clicking on your stupid cat blog website. It's not a point up for debate. "Ownership" comes from the state, lol. Without the state to protect it, you have no ownership.

I don’t think an AnCap France would be able to resist Germany either

The point is, in an AnCap society, doing such is much easier. There are alot of bad guys out there, not excluded in an ancap society. There will always be an overdog and as a matter of fact, an AnCap society could always sooner or later be dominated by this overdog, effectively forming a state.
That’s why Anarchistic societies never last

>But privately owning slaves with no institution is easily possible, which is being talked about here you fucking retard.
Not possible without undue aggression, therefore wrong according to the NAP. If OP had thought about the issue for more than 2 seconds he wouldn't have posted that retarded pic.

> if my city was privitized people like you wouldn't be allowed to enter
who is gona stop them?
> economical sanctions,
who will enforce them?

>Not possible without undue aggression, therefore wrong according to the NAP
the nap works even if no one enforces the nap

>you have an ideology
Ancapism isn't an ideology, it's an ethical theory dumbass, it doesn't propose a society model

>that itself prohibits the imposition of that ideology and has not mechanism to enforce it
Dude you're just ignorant about what you're trying to refute
m.youtube.com/watch?v=M8xSCzggWe8

You just confirm my point that socialists/statists are just victims of their own ignorance

>That's just a temporary possession
And this is how we do the full circle arguing. I already explained you that your current private property, through the existence of expropriation and taxes that can end in "repossession" when not paid, means your possession under the state is simply usufruct.

Therefore, the market offers the same kind of private property as the state, which means the state is not necessary to have private property.

Its not something thats accepted its something thats necessary in order to stay competitive. the authority that enforces it is the authority of evolution.

>but I see the necessity for a framework enforced by an authority, and not just accepted by a society
m.youtube.com/watch?v=M8xSCzggWe8
You don't need an autorithy, you need incentives enough to make people not commit crimes
Private neighborhoods workers for robbery for example, people in brazil for example are already doing it because they're tired of the fucking State
g1.globo.com/rio-de-janeiro/noticia/com-autorizacao-da-prefeitura-moradores-cercam-bairro-vila-kosmos-na-zona-norte.ghtml

Ironically yes, and they seem to be partially a thing somewhere. But they still have to follow regulations and rules mandated by the government. And some still have government institutions present, albeit in a much weaker and significant form

Well you see in a libertarian system the state is limited to defending the population and organizing courts.
The non-agression principle is an ideal used to curtail the growth of government and be the backbone of civil law not something there to prevent the state from doing it's job.
Frankly if you aren't a monarchist or a minarchist you aren't a libertarian

>who is gona stop them?
Uh, the"consumers" that paid for the city? If the city"owner" allowed criminals people would stop buying the city services as well as devalue the commercial centers, so they benefit on keeping criminals at bay
Again it's just another "im ignorant about reality therefore State"

>who will enforce them?
You're asking who's going to make people stop selling to criminals?

Viral propagation is subjugation. Lock it down.
t. libertarianfag

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>a small village with a tiny population
Bring me examples of bigger societies. Such societies would still be possible even with some form of a state. They are known as Republics and early US is one of them

>ethical theory.

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>There is no "ownership" of anything without a government. Not yourself, not others
Uh...
mises.org/library/argumentation-ethics-and-liberty-concise-guide
You're basically saying you're too much if an idiot to control yourself so the government somehows control your actions and thoughts for you

What the fuck are you talking about?
Slavery is not allowed under ANCAP
As a matter of fact, ANCAP are pro "reparations" if you can prove that your ancestors were slaves and who benefited from their work

>I think politiball memes are reliable sources of information.

>And some still have government institutions present, albeit in a much weaker and significant form

Im an ancap and, if my country was ancap, I'd like to live in a private city with "government".

In the same way I wouldn't like to live in a building where there's no regulations for building swimming pools in the rooftop. We don't want the elimination of law and regulations, we want its privatization and we have plenty of suggestions as to how to do that.

so ancaps believe that blacks africans should pay african americans, who in turn should pay white americans?
because africans did the enslaving, and african americans have been far overcompensated compared to what a poor white farmer would have made picking cotton.

Sounds like a job.

Many people will resort to unlawful actions if they have no livelihood opportunities, worse they would be recruited by armed syndicates, just like in Brazil. Gated communities are prevalent in corrupt crime ridden shitholes, but not in integral societies with a competent government.
Would you say no person would be poor or recruited in objectively bad organizations that could threaten your life in an Ancap society?

>As a matter of fact, ANCAP are pro "reparations" if you can prove that your ancestors were slaves and who benefited from their work

wat

Nah you're just moving goalposts into a more philosophical discussion about what "ownership" means outside of a political context because IDK, I guess you have no argument (obviously, since you're trying to argue an inarguable point). Our definition of "ownership" in society is not permanent. It's temporary. But not under any of the same circumstances as what we're describing with a stateless society. It's not even remotely comparable. You're just getting really semantic and pedantic in order to (probably intentionally) obscure the actual point which is that you can't "own" anything without a state.

>Bring me examples of bigger societies
Why? The State is impossible to be efficient or even work in any scale, ancapism works in every single universe configuration
Though a point can be made that the State would invade an ancapistan and be successful if people wanted an State, but economy tells that would be very unlikely
A real world example would be estonia, which after germany basically left it stateless the soviet union tried to invade it
Now, people all over europe become volunteers to defeat the soviets for a very simple reason, on one side you have a free region with no regulations or taxes, perfect for getting richer, on the other you have a sociopathic mafia trying to impose communism. Which do you think the market chose?

Hey retard, slavery was never totally abolished.
>Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, , shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
>except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted
So millions of inmates and ex cons in america are denied their human rights under the pretense that they are slaves. Literally.
But nobody will read this, and nobody will vote for Wayne. Its maddening.

>As a matter of fact, ANCAP are pro "reparations" if you can prove that your ancestors were slaves and who benefited from their work
Yes, jews would have to pay a lot for their slaves, ancaps aren't retarded statists that believe people need to pay for things they didn't ask or deserve

>ancapism works in every single universe configuration

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>Bring me examples of bigger societies
Does lichestein work? The guy wanted citizens to have individual sovereignty

I'm not moving it into a philosophical discussion, you claimed that the market can offer only temporary private property, unlike the state.

I told you why the state's private property is just about as temporary as the market's, and explained how. Now you may digress, but you're not giving arguments as to why I'm wrong.