So I recently got a little more familiar with the term "capeshit", general view of it by its critics and what it is.
From my (brief) look, main complaints seem to be:
>Too clean and simple
>Repititive storylines
>And general childish feel
Now, I agree that you'd have to make an impossibly good case to argue the MCU is the anywhere near the highest forms of cinema but I still respect it for what it did for long term storytelling. Something that looks more akin to a TV series in movie format. Which for some reason it seems a bit looked down upon by industry elitists and mainstream audiences. Is it because you think the film is downgraded by having to set up or interact with another story? Is the long time investment the thing that bugs people?
Because on that note, going back to the third point, older audiences seem to look down upon getting invested in fictional worlds and characters, and prefer grounded dramas and think pieces. Why do you think this is wrong? I think there's something to getting invested in fictional worlds even as an adult, so to me this behaviour comes off as more of a shallow interpretation of stories of that nature in favour of momentary experiences. Not saying that either is more or less complex, just different.
So I'd like to ask you why do hate capeshit, why do you like in place of it, how you could like capeshit (that is how you'd make the MCU a "higher form of cinema") and how you view these more fictional and fantastical stories as a whole? Just to get a better a grip on how you think.
Capeshit and stuff
holyshit man some people just dont lile comicbook superhero shit. some people just dont wanna see it. do you really think people would need to justify why they dont want to see my little pony or barbie movies? dumb cunt.
You're completly justified to dislike it. I just want to know why, because some seem to despise it with a passion like they see it as a cancer in media.
I just want to how and why you think that way and what would make it better.
If you just don't care and don't like genre, that's fine.
>like they see it as a cancer in media
Because it is
Thanks to endless soiboys consuming capeshit, Disney has money to buy up all possible media properties and turn it into more capeshit
>it seems a bit looked down upon by industry elitists and mainstream audiences.
It made nearly three billion fucking dollars, stop with the victim complex already. Most people love capeshit. Capeshit, at least marvel, is immensely profitable and will keep being made no matter how many times Scorsese calls it out on how shit they are. Your movies are not under any threat, Ain fact, Marvel is the apex predator of mainstream cinema and is doing a great job killing any competition.
I get that but would that be to blame on mainstream consumer mentality and not flick's overall quality and merits?
Because this is sounding like a "Bad fanbase makes IP bad" case.
>why do hate capeshit
Market saturation.
>what do you like in place of it
What do you mean by this? What genre of films would I like better? What decade produced better mass market pictures?
>how you'd make the MCU a "higher form of cinema"
I don't know if it could be done, but something that would make them more palatable would be less of them.
>how you view these more fictional and fantastical stories as a whole?
What do you mean by this?
Fortunately for us, Netflix may just destroy Disney by offering an alternative to cinemas only showing one Disney film on all screens for a week
Ever heard the "don't take too seriously argument"? Or the "that's kids stuff"? That's what I meant by that and I was referring to investment in fictional stories as whole. Like getting really into, idk Halo Lore, and getting told you're a *something* for it. There's still a bit of a disdain for this aspect of nerd culture imo.
I don't fear for Marvel's financial safety in any way. I just want to know how others view it.
>what do you like in place of it?
Just what type of movies you prefer as opposed to capeshit
>how you view...
If you think that someone getting very invested in a story, like watching all of the MCU line up for example, is bad, why?
>nerd culture
Okay? There will always be disdain for people who get really into stuff that has little actual depth. Learn to live with it or broaden your horizons already, man.
What the hell else am I suppose to call it?
>I get that but..
just fuck off
I don’t watch children’s films because I’m not a child.
Well I think that that little depth depends on what you get out of it. Say you get so into judge dredd you want to make a cosplay, so you learn and own all the skills to make said costume and you just got new skills out of your niche interest. Also what is little depth? One can see a puddle and other an ocean. Not to mention this interest might be just one of many.
Just answer the question.
What classifies as a children's film?
You have to grow up.
>what type of movies you prefer as opposed to capeshit
Hitchcock films.
>you think that someone getting very invested in a story... is bad?
No.
>One can see a puddle and other an ocean.
Yeah, and one of the two is always wrong.
Also the one who is wrong, most of the times doesn't understand why he is wrong and becomes a rabid apologist
>getting very invested in a story
if you get very invested in childish shit it's definitely a bad thing
Grow up and grow some critical thinking. You'll just know
I mean depth in the work itself. You could make the most complicated and screen-accurate Iron Man suit in the world and it still wouldn't make Marvel movies anything more than comic book movies made for children and infantilised adults.
>Grow up
Because not having nicher interest means you're an adult. What do yiu actually mean by this?
So the carpenter is wrong for having a hobby in making wooden toys even though you don't see any gratification in that?
>this thread of a soiboy trying to find justification for watching Marvel movies whole spergs rip him apart
I think a lot of the animus against capeshit is market saturation. Look at the top ten grossing films of the last 50yrs by decade- the quality drops in the 00's and becomes homogeneous capeshit in the 10's.
Doesn't that start from the pov that comic book or superhero movies are inherently inferior?
They mostly are, especially Marvel.
I watched like 50%-60% of the lineup and rewatched few. I just want to have a discussion about their merit as movies or lack their of.
Fair. I prefer DC's stuff for the most part since Marvel is a little too clean for my tastes but I don't think they are entirely worthless.
Into the Spiderverse was pretty enjoyable as a superhero flick and an animated film.
>So the carpenter is wrong for having a hobby in making wooden toys even though you don't see any gratification in that?
False equivalence.
The correct one would be
>So the manchild is wrong for having a hobby in obsessing over funko pops even though you don't see any gratification in that?
and the answer would be yes
MCU=DCEU
same cancer. One being aimed at toddlers and the other at early teens doesn't make a difference
You're talking about the extreme of negative ways people obsess over media.
I refering to getting invested in an IP in way that's remarkably more in depth than "normal".
I prefer DC as an IP, not their movie line up. Suicide squad is one of the few movies I hate.
this thread reeks of reddit
ever since marvel was successful with guardians of the galaxy and iron man 1 they have figured out the "formula" to churn out the same garbage over and over
children and adults who havent grown up will eat this shit up but the rest of us are fucking sick of it
im sick of fucking superhero movies, im sick of their style of humor and quips and their awful action scenes and shitty overuse of CGI
and what the fuck is "long term storytelling"? you mean never wrapping up a story so you have an excuse to milk more money from future movies? after credits scenes getting you that excited huh
how about wrapping the story up properly with the time allotted? not everything should go on forever because youre too immature to see your fantasy characters go away
capeshit is to cinema what instant noodles is to cuisine
I see long term storytelling as a way to take full advantage of a setting and tell more complex narratives.
You can argue about whether or notit should have wrapped up earlier but I see some settings are very good for that type of structure, mainly in scifi and fantasy. Though admittedly Marvel may have not pulled of in the best way it was still one of the most consistent from the ones who tried and that's what I respect about.
If there's potential for more I'm on board with exploring that more.
Like I said, it's a TV series in movie form. If you don't like that format that's fine but I don't see it as inferior.
>If you don't like that format that's fine but I don't see it as inferior.
no retard, I don't really care about capeshit because really most movies now suck, creation has been taken from the hands of artists and put into the hands of graph-following executives
but to say a multi-billion dollar franchise dominating theaters is respectable just because it tells the same stupid story over and over again and makes a lot of money, you're fucking retarded. fifteen years of these stupid movies and they've never once made anything remotely interesting or of any artistic/literary merit
if an economist wants to write down marvel because it shows how to most effectively milk people for their money, fine. but if a tv critic does, they're a retard that values consumption over merit.
dont reply to me redditor
its inferior because the "format" (read: formula) sucks and it doesnt help that the acting and cgi and fight choreography and jokes are all garbage too and tacking on additional movies or stretching plotlines over a "long term" doesnt make it better
marvel employees should be dragged into the streets and beaten for flooding the market with these shitty no effort formulaic movies
this
you have to be a smoothbrain to watch the same poorly-done action movie over and over again and still call it good because it has pretty colors
desu i think the old cowboy and war films popular from the 40s to to 60s were far worse than MCU. boring. churning out the same plots and bad acting constantly.
Yeah, yeah.
>I'm a true tard and I'm really angry, you can see because I'm calling for violence and will say I unironically believe that if asked
I specified that don't think Marvel did it even 75% right, and their formula gets tiring and yeah overuse of CGI will be make it dated in 10 years. But I still respect for what they proved can be done with long narratives. The long doesn't make it better, but it has the potential to be. You just need to kake clearly defined arcs and take a few breaks so the audience doesn't get sick of it, which is what happened with the MCU.
>I see long term storytelling as a way to take full advantage of a setting and tell more complex narratives
yeah it sounds good on paper but marvel didnt really tell a complex narratives in the first place. the long term story telling as you call it is just more of the same types of movies. sometimes not enhancing the bigger story at all.
>I prefer DC as an IP,
Me too, even if I dropped comics after flashpoint
Fair. They could have worked much better to give a back and forth between the heros and villains to make the culminations more impactful
>dont HECKIN talk about my capeshit that way
Good superhero movie check:
Batman 1966
Superman
Superman II
Batman 1989
Batman Returns
Spiderman
Spiderman 2
Spiderman 3
Ironman
Captain America 1
Man of Steel
X-Men Days of Future Past
The Wolverine
Logan
Half of Batman v Superman
Guardians of the Galaxy 2
Wonder Woman
Aquaman
desu why does scorsese think he can say capeshit is crap? i honest to gos dont believe hes seen one second of a capeshit dilm
In terms of narrative they did sweet fuck all. They make stand alone movies (and this plural is in quotation marks because they are all the same movie) and then they "connect" them with a post credit scene, and then they have Avengers movies where all these independent characters come together to have a similarly structured movie. Why doesn't Thor helps in the Iron Man movies for instance? No reason. The Marvel Cinematic Universe is certainly poor cinema and not an universe at all
My biggest complaint is the amount of CGI in all the shit. It’s why I hate Jurassic world too
>dont mock me
Yeah. It's very
>set up character
>set up character
>culmination
>Repeat
There are a few exceptions in between, black widow and Fury get thrown a around more than others but most likely because they are cheaper to film.
"long term investment" is such bullshit, because all the plots in these movies are just about getting mcguffins, doing cool setpieces and setting up for a potential sequel. Also the quipping becomes old real fast.
I forgot the Nolan Batman trilogy. Fuck the MCU.
user stop talking to the mirror
This
Longterm investment in the MCU's case, but not as a whole. It's important to make the distinction.
And yeah quipping gets old. Either you get really iconic ones like in the 80s or it becomes date. Good source of cheap humour thou
Exactly, from a narrative perspective all they did was hoard characters and then throw them into a CGI battle, just make them run at each other or some CGI power rangers tier nameless minion. Where's the investment? Where are the stakes? Will Starlord find some mcguffin in his fetch quest movie #4959 but GET THIS now he has BLACK HECKIN PANTHER with him!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 Miss me with that onions shit my nibba
>Superman
>Superman II
>Batman 1989
>Batman Returns
>Spiderman
>Spiderman 2
>Ironman
>Logan
>Batman Begins
>TDK
And I'm being generous
Fags don't like capeshit because it is too optimistic and straightforward instead of subverting things. They think that subversion is needed to make things 'smart' because they grew up in a post-9/11 world where it's a dirty thing to be proud and ideologically strong
This. They are just 2 hours long trailes for the next 2 hours long trailer
>posing as adult
>to defend capeshit
Kys, mongoloid