List 5 valid reasons why it should be independent

They shouldn't. Their monarch, half a millennium ago, decided it was a good idea to unite with the Castillians. Same thing with the Scots. They willingly gave up their independece.
On the other hand, all of the moments Spain ruled over Portugal were through usurping the throne, while the people rebelled against them.
Cuntalans don't deserve independence

Has it's own language
Has it's own culture
Has bad history with Spanish monarchs/rulers
Majority of Catalans WANT independence
Similar history to my nation and everyone said "it will never happen, you will die without Moscow or Poland" or whatever the f.
So I guess 5th reason is because I would like to see it be it's own country with it's own government/economy. The more the merrier. Kek

They can't win it simply because of sheer numbers. They need to wait it out until a period of greater instability :)

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españa es una y no cincuentayuna

> it should be independent.
It is an Andalusian colony , 8M people and

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Oh, and P.S. Catalans were the first to have the balls send an envoy to Lithuania when we were the first country breaking away from the USSR, saying they support our fight. Pretty much every other country in Europe at that stage was still either:
"Err... let's see how this boils down first"
or
"They will never be able to do, so let's not get into this."

my greatest ally

Cause the west supported Kosovos independence, so everyone should have the same rights no?

>They can't win it simply because of sheer numbers.
the Algerian War / Vietnam War and the likes have proven that it is entirely possible, you only need to stir up enough shit to tire the people on the colonizing side enough so that they pressure their government to pull out.
In short
> lose the war effectively
> adopt guerilla tactics
> eventually sunken cost fallacy gets realized by attackers
> pull out
> be independent and king of the ashes
My point being that they should be ready to fight for it anyway, because it is pure wishful thinking for them to think it'll happen democratically.

its*

Europe wouldn't intervene but powerful countries such as The UK & France would not like an independent Catalonia at all either since it would set a worrying example for their own pro-independence movements. They'd likely help the Spanish gvt behind the scenes.

what part of France is the government worried about demanding independence?

Catalonians are pushing Roussillon, historically Corsica too idk about the others

everywhere but paris lmao

fuck off anglo scum

Corsica and Brittany have their own meme independence movement. They are not taken very seriously for the later but the former can be headache-inducing assholes, though manageable as of yet.
New Caledonia is also a semi-colony at the other edge of the world that will hold two independence referendums in the next five years (one has already gone down in 2017 and "remain" has won). People would gracefully accept New Caledonia leaving though, but parts of Metropolitan France ? Things would get messy

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they are a cowards , Look how he kisses a dictator's ass when they want

youtube.com/watch?v=SobVbk2w2YM

Well that seems a little bit bias, sir :)
Allow me to play the devil's advocate for a moment in this discussion if you will.
Don't people choose their own identity and haven't the people that went there self-catalanized(for lack of a better word) and fallen in love with the culture? I mean... if we were to get into specifics, someone's quite mixed with Muslims from the south who have taken up Spanish culture, no? :)

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t. Napoleon

Lmfao probably half of these people in the video now are for the independence.
How hypocrites

da fuck happened in 31 years

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Hey, hush fag
United we stand

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so mixed argentinians want to destroy spain and europe.

a lot of these are wrong just shut the fuck up

On election of 13 sept. 1897:
"...However, the French government rejected the involvement of UN observers."
Now I wonder WHY oh WHY would they do that? KEK

Name one

mejority of catalans dont want independence

No valid reasons for that to happen

They just don't like to express it, right? Kek

no?

you will be nismeado if you keep making public our secrets

Piss off the Spainiards
Piss off the Spainiards
Piss off the Spainiards
Piss off the Spainiards
Piss off the Spainiards

what do you mean
the Catalans are Spanish

Here's what would happen if sc*talans declared independence:
>They would have to pay all the billions that they owe to the central government.
>They would have to try to join the EU again by their own, which obviously wouldn't be that easy if Spain didn't want them to.
>They would have to start to build embassies everywhere and have the support of the rest of the world for independence to be recogniced as a country.
>A lot of their market would be lost and part of it has already been lost since a good amount of companies changed their region after all the referendum bullshit.

Most of the people that want independence are the typical 20/early 30 years old retards that go to protests just to set trashcans on fire without thinking about what would happen if they were to be independent. Most adults or old people don't want it.

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based

mis dies

I hate Messi.
I hate FCB
I am a monarchist
Catalans don't really helped us
Kingdom of Aragon > Cataniggeria

I want Spain to be

PLUS ULTRA

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This + Morocco

>da fuck happened in 31 years

> 1988
> 60% people voting, mostly French Whites

> cue in several violent crisis during the 90's

> 2018
> 80% people voting, including Natives
> what a shocker

Shit went down in the 90's and when people voted in 2018, everybody actually participated (and still, "remain" won since rich White French are demographically a majority on the island).
Which is, of course, fucking over the Natives big time.

Also this

>They would have to pay all the billions that they owe to the central government.
Who knows who would technically have to pay whom. This boils down to on what terms and by what methods independence is achieved though.
>They would have to try to join the EU again by their own, which obviously wouldn't be that easy if Spain didn't want them to.
Isn't Spain drowning in debt to the EU and Catalans offered to pay all of their part down to the last cent for the acceptance of the EU? Or am I totally in the wrong here?
>They would have to start to build embassies everywhere and have the support of the rest of the world for independence to be recogniced as a country.
I can name a large list of countries that would agree just off the top of my head.
>A lot of their market would be lost and part of it has already been lost since a good amount of companies changed their region after all the referendum bullshit.
Happens to most countries after independence, but then it stabilized and starts to grow. The really big advantage is that they're not landlocked in a situation like that.

A lot of older people have to care for their kids and are scared of prison and not being able to take care of their families (though I'm generalizing from a historical perspective in other countries, correct me if I'm wrong about the situation there)
Also, seems to me like the Spanish government really is worried, because just one higher ranking parliamentarian here in the small country of Lithuania on the other side of the continent expressed his opinion, simply saying that "I think people have the right to hold a position of self-determination" about the situation. (Literally all he said, he didn't even say he was pro Catalan independence" or anything) and the Spanish government summoned the heads of the 2 Lithuanian embassies in Spain demanding to "explain THEMSELVES" (I guess implying that they must be part of the same position as that one parliamentarian as well? xD) KEK

Do Spaniards really want Moroccans to be part of Spain? :) (At least the few that I met weren't too hot about that idea, but maybe they were the minority, idk)

People keep saying that catalonia has its own culture, but what exactly makes catalonian culture so different from the rest of Spain, aside from having logs shitting out presents on christmas?

>Do Spaniards really want Moroccans to be part of Spain?
well, half of their countrymen already live here so...

i meant , this part >At least the few that I met weren't too hot about that idea, but maybe they were the minority, idk
i meant

>Who knows who would technically have to pay whom
Dude they own the central government billions, simple as that. And if they wanted to pay whatever sum to the EU (which I haven't seen anywhere, and that depends of who said that and if it's not a lie) they better learn to make money appear out of nowhere.

I don't know why you seem to want its independence so bad, most of them don't even know your country exists

We had part of Morocco as a protectorate so I'm just joking, but most people don't want to know anything about Morocco.

>My Catolonie brideris mon be frie! Thay mon be frie! Frie fae nidder o the Spaingie! Oor brideris mon be fre!

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there will be a rope for you
you are the new moors

Many regions in Spain have their own language and cultures.

It-t's just a fluke b-bros
rt.com/news/482023-catalan-leader-puigdemont-speak-/

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People on favor of independance boycotted the référendum, it wasn't rigged

>50% or so of separatists in catalonia are ironically argentines
I bet there's a credible source to this claim.

Yeah, I know they boycotted it, but why would the government NOT accept participation of neutral observers appointed by UN? Why would they have the need/want for that?

they have their own traditional clothing which is totally different, they have people shitting in Catholic baby Jesus' birthplace, they build big human towers and even compete when doing it (even little villages have their own teams and practice in their free time), they have unique dishes, including on with a unique way to drink wine, they have their own national dishes, their own national epic and hero and many other things (google can be your friend for this, if you're actually curious :) )